Ben Sigelman and RJ Jainendra discuss ServiceNow’s latest announcement that Lightstep is extending beyond observability and creating a differentiated portfolio for app development with the general availability of Lightstep Incident Response, helping make organizations’ digital products and services more reliable and resilient. The video is below followed by a transcript of the conversation.

Alan Shimel: Hey, everyone. Welcome to Techstrong TV’s segment today. We’ve got some breaking news I wanna bring to you, and I’m really happy to be joined by two gentlemen who are gonna tell you the news. I’ve had the pleasure of having them on before.

They’re two really bright guys from ServiceNow. Let me introduce you to Ben Sigelman and RJ Jainendra from ServiceNow. RJ, I think I left out an “N” somewhere in that second or third syllable, but we’ll let you correct it. I’m gonna ask you to go first, RJ. Introduce yourself to the audience.

RJ Jainendra: Hey, Alan, good to see you again. And no, you got it right, RJ Jainendra. I’m a VP and GM at ServiceNow, unlocking product growth at the company. It’s great to be here.

Alan Shimel: Excellent. It’s good to see you again. And of course, RJ, you’re general manager, but you’re the portfolio you are GM with includes observability. I believe it includes value stream as well, yeah?

RJ Jainendra: So, ServiceNow does have offerings for value stream management, which brings together a number of different product lines. Our IT business management, which we recently rebranded as Service Portfolio Management, SPM, that’s one. The second is it also brings in elements from devops and ITSM offerings to provide a value stream management.

But I’m here today to talk about Lightstep Incident Response. That’s the product line that we’ve been building out for a little while now, and ready to launch here today.

Alan Shimel: Absolutely, so, we’re gonna talk about Lightstep. Gotta have Ben here. Ben, welcome. Why don’t you give people a little bit of – give the folks a little bit of your background?

Ben Sigelman: Yeah, thanks, Alan, for having us. So, I’m Ben Sigelman. I was one of the cofounders at Lightstep and was the CEO up through last year, when we were acquired. ServiceNow wasn’t willing to let me remain the CEO of ServiceNow after the acquisition, so now I’m also a VP and GM, along with RJ. 

Lightstep’s brand and certainly our products and many aspects of our culture have actually been intentionally retained as part of the acquisition, and the brand has actually been expanded to be a multi-product brand, which is what we’re talking about today.

Most of my day-to-day is spent doing a combination of thinking about the product vision for observability specifically within Lightstep as well as the longer-term strategy within ServiceNow, and what we can do for our customers by unifying the world of ServiceNow with the world of high-volume customer-facing applications that Lightstep tends to play in.

Alan Shimel: Absolutely. I think the ServiceNow team already has a pretty good guy in its CEO, but hey.

Ben Sigelman: I actually, when I talked to Bill during the acquisition, I told him he had my condolences for being a CEO of a much larger company. I knew how stressful it was for Lightstep, so I can only imagine what it’s like for him. But he’s a fantastic guy.

Alan Shimel: Absolutely. Yes, until you’ve been a CEO, and I don’t care whether it’s a really, really big company or a really small company, yeah, it’s a lot. Anyway, guys, let’s talk Lightstep, observability. Let’s talk about the expansion. Just to level-set things – you both referenced it – Lightstep was one of the leaders in this observability revolution or wave that we saw overtake the industry, let’s say, in the last three, four years, certainly, it really caught fire.

Lightstep, Ben and your two cofounders, I believe, all came from Google, and really in many ways helped initiate the whole observability revolution there. Then leveraging open source and working with open source, open telemetry, et cetera, really built quite a community and following.

ServiceNow, one of the most dynamic companies in our industry, recognized this and made Lightstep and observability an important part of the ServiceNow offering. But from what I’m hearing and reading between the lines is why stop there, right? There’s more.

There’s more that the marriage of ServiceNow’s know-how market intelligence and skill set, and the Lightstep platform can do more, and today marks a significant expansion of that. So, you’re both GMs. Who wants to go first to talk about what this new expansion is?

RJ Jainendra: So, I can talk a little bit about what the expansion is, and Ben can, I think talk through why it makes a ton of sense, what we’re doing. The thing that we see that’s happening in the market is just the amount of investment going into what’s been called digital transformation.

It’s just increasing significantly, and I think by some accounts, IDC forecast, it’s gonna be something like north of $10 trillion cumulative by 2025. So what Marc Andreessen said a long time ago, I think it has come to pass, which is every company is a software company, and increasingly, with the adoption of cloud, organizations are prioritizing cloud operations and software development teams they build, and they run these millions of new customer-facing, revenue-generating applications and services.

So from that perspective, the SREs and developers who really are responsible for keeping applications reliable and resilient, they really start impacting the business outcome. That’s where if you have incidents that occur, maybe it’s a bug or some sort of an outage or poor performance, it has a major impact on revenue, on customer loyalty, on the brand perception.

That’s why you see the option in the market to introduce a new offering around incident response, which really leverages the power of the ServiceNow platform, but then it brings together the observability capabilities that Lightstep has into sort of a holistic offering that we can bring into market to help customers become more proactive and more effective in addressing issues. Ben, do you wanna add to that in terms of your perspective from an observability side?

Ben Sigelman: Yeah, for sure. I think the way I’d explain it is observability, Alan, I would agree with you that it’s the wave, but it’s a very confusing, diffuse – it’s a body of water right now that can be hard to wrap your head around, and you frankly have a lot of what I would call legacy observability companies trying to take what they have and call it observability, because that’s easier than reforming it.

So, it might be helpful to spend just one very quick, 30 second snippet talking about what observability actually is, architecturally. You have some layer at the bottom of integrations and data acquisition. You mentioned Open Telemetry earlier. The Lightstep Incident Response product that we’re announcing today also has an integration ecosystem built around it.

But you have the acquisition of data, you have some kind of data platform where you store that, which I’m not gonna talk about in detail right now but I think is an interesting topic, slightly far afield. Then you have workflow been made with your full knowledge and workflow built on top of that, and that’s where the actual value is delivered.

A lot of the conversation around observability today is that you have a silo for your metric system, a silo for your logging system. Maybe you tack on some kind of tracing or PM system, and then you integrate them in the browser.

Then you also have this Incident Response thing over there. That’s some other vendor, and it does not make any sense. When we talked with our customers, the three things they are prioritizing are overall performance, velocity, and actually, most importantly, incident response and timed resolution.

It’s the most important thing for observability. Then you have not just a separate tab, but a separate product to do incident management and incident response, which is not sensible from a workflow standpoint.

So, for the brand, this is a very obvious and natural thing, to have incident response and observability integrated into a single experience, especially incident response where seconds matter, and a context switch like that is very expensive. So, anyway, that’s why this makes a ton of sense to us.

It goes right at the heart of the MPTR problem, to have a single platform to manage the full lifecycle of incident management on the observability side and on the incident response side.

Alan Shimel: Absolutely, and you know, Ben, to your point – well, first of all, I think you call them “legacy observability vendors.” Really, they’re APM, application performance management vendors who – 

Ben Sigelman: Or infrastructure monitoring vendors, more to the point.

Alan Shimel: Right, or infrastructure – 

Ben Sigelman: It’s not the –

Alan Shimel: You know, everyone loves a good name.

Ben Sigelman: Right.

Alan Shimel: A company I had started, we had come out with a product that Gartner would later name the category NAC, network access control. We had some stupid name for it before, but Gartner, you know, did that.

All of a sudden, out of the woodwork, all these people who were doing totally different things started calling what they do NAC. A very similar thing happened with observability, right?

Ben Sigelman: Yeah.

Alan Shimel: Anyone who’s doing monitoring, all of a sudden it was observability. But I think, also to your point, was that observability got siloed into just observing. Almost by definition, observing, observability, is not actionable. It’s almost like observability is a passive word, where actionable is active word.

Ben Sigelman: You’re exactly – that’s a very good point. If you go – I tend to be a little academic, but I think this is an interesting point. Observability really originates from control theory in the 1960s, and it was this smaller, kind of lesser cousin to controllability, which is kind of what you’re talking about.

Controllability is really the thing that matters. If you can control a system, there are scientific ways of talking about that. Mathematical ways talking about that. To a certain extent, you can think of incident response as being the controllability side of what we’re talking about here.

It’s like we’re making insights from observability actionable with the Incidence Response product, and that’s a really important part of actually closing the loop on the control theory of modern distributed systems. That’s a great insight that you’re making, Alan.

Alan Shimel: Yep, thank you. Every once in a while, even a blind squirrel finds something, right? So, RJ, let’s talk about this. ServiceNow is not a trivial size company. To decide that – you didn’t really have an incident response solution in market prior to this, as far as I know. I’m not an expert on everything ServiceNow, but I’m not aware of it.

To say okay, we are going to build this in as the logical next step in the Lightstep platform, just the inertia sometimes in an organization your size, it’s difficult. Let’s hear from your point of view what it took to make that happen, turn that ship.

RJ Jainendra: Yeah, so, Alan, we actually do have capabilities in the ServiceNow platform through our IT Service Management and IT Operation Management products, around things like event technology around event correlation, being able to take large-scale number of events from the observability tools and bring them in and understand what those events mean.

We also do have functionality in ITSM around notifying the right person. But really, the ServiceNow technology, we have great adoption with IT organizations and a large number of customers. But what we’re seeing really is as our customers are going through the digital transformation, they’re reorganizing, and the product teams that are out there are the ones that are sent to adopt these technologies on observability. 

That’s why we felt that we wanted to bring an offering into market that could be adopted by teams. So, the entire experience for Lightstep Incident Response is as a modern SaaS application. If you’re a developer on the team – and what we’re finding right now is a lot of our initial customers are smaller companies.

They’re early growth-stage companies that are post-revenue. They have customers, they wanna make sure that their systems are highly available for them. So, what we’re finding is that they can come online, they can sign up, and within a few seconds get access to the system, start using it, and if they see value, then they can swipe the credit card and they’re off to the races.

So, very much a different motion, really suited to how teams out there in smaller companies are adopting technology. And of course, the startups of today are the ones that become the unique ones tomorrow, so that’s what we’re doing that’s a little bit different. But for ServiceNow customers, they need to have those capabilities within the ServiceNow platform.

Alan Shimel: Excellent. So, guys, let’s talk – if you don’t mind, I gotta do a little meat-and-potatoes here. You guys announced this today. Is it available? When will it be available?

RJ Jainendra: It is available today on Lightstep.com. So, we have had the product in the market for a little bit. We did a soft launch earlier last year. So, it’s been battle-tested, and we have a number of customers that have come online. They’re using it in production. So, it is available today, and it doesn’t take more than an email to sign up and get going.

Alan Shimel: What’s the offering? How is it priced? If you’re an existing Lightstep or ServiceNow customer, how do you – firing off an email, yeah, but how do I – what’s this gonna set – you know, what’s involved here?

RJ Jainendra: Yep, so, actually, it isn’t a whole lot more complicated than what I just said, which is just as you sign up for a lot of consumer-type services online, developers and SREs can get started with an email. We do have a couple of different tiers. So, we do have a free tier, where if you are just getting started and you may have just a couple of services that you’re monitoring and addressing issues for with Incident Management, that’s free.

Now, if you’re gonna start scaling up and you have more than two, that’s when the pricing kicks in. We are taking an innovative approach in terms of pricing, which is it’s based on usage. So, we look at the number of active services that a team has, and then we charge by the number of active services, which is very different than some of the other solutions in the market, which charge by the number of developers that you have in the system.

We really think that we wanna align to the value that our customers are trying to deliver, which at the end of the day, if you’re a developer or if you’re an SRE, your goal is to deliver these resilient, reliable services. So, we feel that aligning to the services – and no matter whether you wanna bring in your whole team or maybe you also wanna bring in sort of extended folks into the solution to be able to collaborate and figure out what the problem is.

So, we don’t wanna let the number of seats become an impediment. We really would like to have our customers drive this notion of service ownership across the entire team, as opposed to being owned by a few key people, because there’s a lot of burnout that happens.

So, there’s different models, but after a 30-day free trial, if customers see value and they have these active services, that’s when the billing kicks in. It’s all done by credit card, so it’s a fairly streamlined experience.

Ben Sigelman: I will add that Lightstep observability experimented with seat-pricing several years ago and abandoned it, because it’s very important for us to deliver value to our customers, and there’s nothing quite as frustrating as hearing people say, oh, we really wanna be using this, but we don’t wanna add another seat license and blah, blah, blah.

I think especially in large organizations, for incident response, it’s just immensely frustrating to be kind of wanting to use something, like, sporadically, maybe once every couple of months, and then being blocked out of the application because of concerns over seat licensing.

So, with Lightstep Incident Response, there’s really no restriction on that. You can have a thousand-head engineering organization and put them into the product, and that doesn’t change your bill at all. The pricing is more correlated to the value that we believe we’re delivering, and the resiliency of the services themselves.

Alan Shimel: Sure. So, I’ve gotta ask the question. I’m gonna ask it of you, Ben. This is a step of taking observability down the control, as you mentioned, the control path, for full control. What’s next?

Ben Sigelman: That’s a good question. We’re gonna move into crypto. No, I’m just kidding, we’re not.

RJ Jainendra: Join the crowd, yeah.

Ben Sigelman: I’m not here to talk about specific products, but directionally for Lightstep as a brand, I think that we see there’s an entire ecosystem out there of – I think you can kind of extrapolate from where I was going with the workflows.

I think where we – actually, Lightstep and ServiceNow are incredibly similar in our belief in workflows being paramount, and there are a number of other workflows where people have to do a major context switch when they’re involved with the work of making reliability and velocity happen for cloud-native applications and for customer-facing applications. That’s kind of a hint as to, I think, where we’re headed with future products. But this certainly isn’t the last one yeah.

Alan Shimel: Great. Guys, we’re way past 15 minutes, but for people who wanna go get Lightstep and Lightstep observability up and running today, where do they go?

RJ Jainendra: www.Lightstep.com.

Alan Shimel: That’s what I was looking for, RJ. Hey, gentlemen – Ben, RJ – thanks so much for coming on and breaking this exciting news and offering, new offering from the Lightstep/ServiceNow team. Keep us posted, best of luck with it. It sounds like a winner. We hope to hear more soon.

RJ Jainendra: Thanks, Alan.

Ben Sigelman: Thank you, Alan.

Alan Shimel: Thank you, guys. All right, go check it out, Lightstep.com, their new observability and incident response now as part of it, from ServiceNow. We’re gonna take a break. We’ll be right back.